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ID Date Author Subject
878   Sat Mar 12 10:13:24 2022 Stefan RittTime calibration and the C++ API

DRSBoard::GetTime is declared in DRS.h line 720.

If you want to measure timing down to ps, you need some basic knowledge, especially about signal-to-noise and risetime. This cannot be taught in a few sentenses, needs a full lecture. As a starting point please read that papat:

https://arxiv.org/abs/1405.4975

then you will understand why you measure different resolutions with different peak heights (and different rise times).

Concerning the DRS4 measurement, please be aware that the sampling poings are not equidistant, like not every 200ps for GSPS. They vary bin by bin significantly, from 50ps to 300ps. So you alway have to analyse the X/Y points as an array, not just the Y values assuming deltaX of 200ps. Probably you forgot that. Then, you have to interpolate between bins to find the crossing over your threshold. Linear interpolation is already good, spline interpolation even better. Deep inside Measurement.cpp of the drsosc program you find in the source code:

t1 = (thr*(x1[i]-x1[i-1])+x1[i-1]*y1[i]-x1[i]*y1[i-1])/(y1[i]-y1[i-1]);

which is the linear interpolation (thr is the threshold). You have to use (and understand!) similar code.

Best,
Stefan

 Matias Senger wrote: I am using the V5 board at a fixed sampling frequency. With the `drsosc` app I have executed the time calibration at 5 GS/s (actually 5.12 GS/s). This is how my setup looks like in the app: Now I want to replicate this using the C++ API (not the positive width measurement shown, the signal sampling only). I am seting the sampling frequency to 5 GS/s, as I do in the `drsosc` app. Then I get the time information using the `DRSBoard::GetTime(unsigned int chipIndex, int channelIndex, int tc, float *time)` function (which I don't find defined either in `DRS.h` or `DRS.cpp` but somehow it works). How can I know if these times that I get here are being corrected with the time calibration? If so, should I expect the time resolution to be < 3 ps? Are these 3 ps accumulative, such that in the end I end up having a contribution from the evaluation board of 3 ps × 5 Gs/s × 100 ns where 100 ns is the time difference between my two pulses? (This does not seem to be the case because if so I would expect the jitter to be ~ 1 ns, and we see that the "Pos Width" measurement is ~ 0.1 ns std.) Why am I asking? I want to measure the jitter between the two falling edges. This cannot be done easily with the `drsosc` app I think, so I am acquiring the data and doing this offline. I have done this measurement in the past using a LeCroy WaveRunner oscilloscope with 20 GS/s and 4 GHz bandwidth (offline, same code) and I have seen it vary from ~5 ps → 30 ps when I vary a voltage that I can control. Now if I calculate this time fluctuation using the data acquired with the V5 evaluation board I get a value ~100 ps and independent of this voltage, which leads me to conclude that the limiting factor is being the evaluation board itself. So now I am wondering if I have reached its limit, or if there is some setting that can still improve this result. Thanks!

879   Sat Mar 12 16:52:36 2022 Matias SengerTime calibration and the C++ API

Dear Stefan,

For the time of each bin I am using the values returend by `GetTime` without any assumption by my side. I did not notice before that the sampling time is not uniform, but I see that this is already happening. This is an example plot from one of the signals I processed:

The bin at 65.5 ns and the next one are closer than their neighbors. So this seems to indicate that the time calibration is being taken into account when I acquire the time bins using `GetTime`, is this correct?

To obtain the final time resolution I am using the constant fraction discriminator method and the signals are linearly interpolated to obtain the time at each percentage value, as seen in the plot. I have already measured time resolutions in the 5-100 ps range with exactly the same setup but using the LeCroy oscilloscope, which I am using just for data acquisition, and my software for offline analysis as shown in the plot above. Now what I am trying to do is to replace the LeCroy by the DRS4 Evaluation Board basically, so I can use the oscilloscope in a different setup.

Best,
Matias.

Stefan Ritt wrote:

DRSBoard::GetTime is declared in DRS.h line 720.

If you want to measure timing down to ps, you need some basic knowledge, especially about signal-to-noise and risetime. This cannot be taught in a few sentenses, needs a full lecture. As a starting point please read that papat:

https://arxiv.org/abs/1405.4975

then you will understand why you measure different resolutions with different peak heights (and different rise times).

Concerning the DRS4 measurement, please be aware that the sampling poings are not equidistant, like not every 200ps for GSPS. They vary bin by bin significantly, from 50ps to 300ps. So you alway have to analyse the X/Y points as an array, not just the Y values assuming deltaX of 200ps. Probably you forgot that. Then, you have to interpolate between bins to find the crossing over your threshold. Linear interpolation is already good, spline interpolation even better. Deep inside Measurement.cpp of the drsosc program you find in the source code:

t1 = (thr*(x1[i]-x1[i-1])+x1[i-1]*y1[i]-x1[i]*y1[i-1])/(y1[i]-y1[i-1]);

which is the linear interpolation (thr is the threshold). You have to use (and understand!) similar code.

Best,
Stefan

 Matias Senger wrote: I am using the V5 board at a fixed sampling frequency. With the `drsosc` app I have executed the time calibration at 5 GS/s (actually 5.12 GS/s). This is how my setup looks like in the app: Now I want to replicate this using the C++ API (not the positive width measurement shown, the signal sampling only). I am seting the sampling frequency to 5 GS/s, as I do in the `drsosc` app. Then I get the time information using the `DRSBoard::GetTime(unsigned int chipIndex, int channelIndex, int tc, float *time)` function (which I don't find defined either in `DRS.h` or `DRS.cpp` but somehow it works). How can I know if these times that I get here are being corrected with the time calibration? If so, should I expect the time resolution to be < 3 ps? Are these 3 ps accumulative, such that in the end I end up having a contribution from the evaluation board of 3 ps × 5 Gs/s × 100 ns where 100 ns is the time difference between my two pulses? (This does not seem to be the case because if so I would expect the jitter to be ~ 1 ns, and we see that the "Pos Width" measurement is ~ 0.1 ns std.) Why am I asking? I want to measure the jitter between the two falling edges. This cannot be done easily with the `drsosc` app I think, so I am acquiring the data and doing this offline. I have done this measurement in the past using a LeCroy WaveRunner oscilloscope with 20 GS/s and 4 GHz bandwidth (offline, same code) and I have seen it vary from ~5 ps → 30 ps when I vary a voltage that I can control. Now if I calculate this time fluctuation using the data acquired with the V5 evaluation board I get a value ~100 ps and independent of this voltage, which leads me to conclude that the limiting factor is being the evaluation board itself. So now I am wondering if I have reached its limit, or if there is some setting that can still improve this result. Thanks!

880   Mon Mar 14 08:59:51 2022 Stefan RittTime calibration and the C++ API

Looks like you have the some time calibration, not sure if it's the correct one. Sample the sine wave from the calibration clock, once with and once without the timing calibration, then you will see if all points lie on a smooth line. Left: without timing calibration, right: with proper timing calibration:

If your points do not lie on a smooth line, you might habe a problem such as the wrong channel for calibration, an offset of 1 in the index of the time array or some other software bug. Measure the same signal with the DRSOsc application and then your code. If the results differ, you have a software problem on your side.

Stefan

881   Tue Mar 15 13:07:50 2022 Matias SengerTime calibration and the C++ API

Thanks for your help. If I look into the app the behavior for the 4 channels is exactly as you show:

Now, when I sample with my code something strange happens, two of the channels are fine and the other two are wrong:

This is a surprise to me because I acquire the 4 channels in the same way within a `for` loop. To get the time data I use `DRSBoard::GetTime` with the `tcalibrated` argument set to `true`. Is there any aditional step to use the calibration?

Best,
Matias.

 Stefan Ritt wrote: Looks like you have the some time calibration, not sure if it's the correct one. Sample the sine wave from the calibration clock, once with and once without the timing calibration, then you will see if all points lie on a smooth line. Left: without timing calibration, right: with proper timing calibration:   If your points do not lie on a smooth line, you might habe a problem such as the wrong channel for calibration, an offset of 1 in the index of the time array or some other software bug. Measure the same signal with the DRSOsc application and then your code. If the results differ, you have a software problem on your side. Stefan

882   Tue Apr 12 10:40:36 2022 LynseyShun

Hello, I am Lynsey. now I set A3-A0 to 1001 in ROI mode, but only OUT0 has output, and the other seven channels(OUT1-OUT7) do not output corresponding waveforms.

In ROI mode, can OUT0-OUT7 output sampled waveforms at the same time?

thank you very much

883   Tue Apr 12 10:49:27 2022 Stefan Ritt

A3-A0 = 1001 should be all you need to activate OUT0-OUT7. It works in our designs. Maybe double check the address lines with an oscilloscope.

Stefan

 LynseyShun wrote: Hello, I am Lynsey. now I set A3-A0 to 1001 in ROI mode, but only OUT0 has output, and the other seven channels(OUT1-OUT7) do not output corresponding waveforms. In ROI mode, can OUT0-OUT7 output sampled waveforms at the same time? thank you very much

884   Thu Jun 16 05:31:25 2022 LynseyShun

Thank you very much for your help!

Stefan Ritt wrote:

A3-A0 = 1001 should be all you need to activate OUT0-OUT7. It works in our designs. Maybe double check the address lines with an oscilloscope.

Stefan

 LynseyShun wrote: Hello, I am Lynsey. now I set A3-A0 to 1001 in ROI mode, but only OUT0 has output, and the other seven channels(OUT1-OUT7) do not output corresponding waveforms. In ROI mode, can OUT0-OUT7 output sampled waveforms at the same time? thank you very much

885   Fri Jun 24 09:57:36 2022 LynseyShunSpikes/noise sensitive to clock settings?

Hello, I now have periodic spikes in CH0 and CH1 output. How can I eliminate these spikes? I'm sorry I didn't understand your elimination method. Please explain the method in detail. Thank you very much

Stefan Ritt wrote:
 Sean Quinn wrote: Dear DRS4 team, I'm trying to troubleshoot some odd spike behavior. If I run the ADC and SR CLK at 16 MHz (behavior also seen at 33 MHz) we get very noisy data (post-calibration) with periodic spikes. In the below plot CH0 & CH1 are muon pulses from a scintillator + SiPM detector CH8 is a 25 MHz sinewave (in phase with all generated board clocks) Transparent mode = ON ROI = OFF, "full readout mode", first sample = cell 0 DRS REFCLK = 1 MHz (2 GS/s) ADC & SR CLK = 16 MHz, 0 deg. offset   After I modify some clock settings, things seem to improve dramatically, and the spike behavior changes ADC and SR CLK = 15 MHz, 0 deg. offset Transparent mode = ON ROI = ON (just for testing purposes) Add 1.064 ns skew to DRS REF CLK NOTE: Unfortunately due to a design mishap, the ADC and FPGA clock use a phase-locked output pair on our clock synthesis chip, so we cannot fine-tune the skew for it. Observed differences Spike polarity seems inverted Spikes limited to smaller number of cells now? Spike amplitude reduced Overall baseline variance seems better New large positive spike artifact on CH0 that seems inverted on CH1 CH8 seems unaffected by large spikes? Artifacts seem related to clock configuration, but I am sort of in the dark on what might be happening from a first-principles point of view. Any tips?   Warm regards, Sean

886   Tue Jul 19 02:35:04 2022 Jingyu ZhangIncrease event rate, use ROI mode, and install sw from source in Mac

Dear experts,

We are trying to increase the event rate of the DRS4. We looked into the ROI but couldn’t figure out how to run in ROI mode. We are wondering if there is pre-existing firmware for this? We also tried to download and build the software from source on MacOS 12.4 but we were not successful. Can you kindly help us with these?

Best regards,

Jingyu

887   Fri Jul 29 14:09:35 2022 Stefan RittIncrease event rate, use ROI mode, and install sw from source in Mac

The firmware from the website always reads 1024 bins. You have to modify it to stop before that, like reading only 128 samples or so. For compiling under MacOSX, this should work, since I do it myself.

Regards,
Stefan

 Jingyu Zhang wrote: Dear experts,  We are trying to increase the event rate of the DRS4. We looked into the ROI but couldn’t figure out how to run in ROI mode. We are wondering if there is pre-existing firmware for this? We also tried to download and build the software from source on MacOS 12.4 but we were not successful. Can you kindly help us with these? Best regards,  Jingyu

888   Fri Jul 29 17:23:43 2022 Stefan RittSpikes/noise sensitive to clock settings?